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Disturbance
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posted 14 June 2021 18:51      Profile for Disturbance   Email Disturbance   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I need some help about the rank structure. My knowledge is limited to this point. I know Capt's in charge of company....lt's in charge of platoons...then there is the sgt's in charge of sections and also the platoon sgt. right?

where do warrant officers fit in? and the diff between 2lt and lt?

I know obviously officers plan, NCMs implement the plan but I need to know the details cause I have some friends makin a military movie and I dont wanna see a sgt given lts orders Otherwise I would just wait till I go on course in a few weeks.

Cheers

Disturbance


Posts: 40 | From: Vancouver, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Gunner
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posted 14 June 2021 19:28      Profile for Gunner   Email Gunner   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Disturbance, there is lots of good info on the www.dnd.ca website. In general:

Infantry Battalion Commanding Officer is a Lieutenant-Colonel (LCol)
Infantry Battalion Regimental Sergeant Major is a Chief Warrant Officer (CWO)

Infantry Company Commander is a Major (Maj)
Infantry Company Sergeant Major is a Master Warrant Officer (MWO)

Infantry Platoon Commander is a Lieutenant/Captain (Lt/Capt)
Infantry Platoon Second in Command is a Warrant Officer (WO)

Section Commanders are Sergeants (Sgt)
Section Second in Command is a Master Corporal (MCpl)

Soldiers are Corporals and Privates (Cpl and Pte)

The difference between a Second Lt (2Lt) and an Lt is time in and experience (possibly the completion of training).

In general the officer plan and lead, the NCOs implement and support their officer. Would a Sgt give a Lt orders? Probably not (depending on the situation) however, the Sgt may be seen giving advise and supporting his Lt. Entirely plausible.

Good Luck on the movie, hope it turns out well.


Posts: 150 | From: Army of the West | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged
Disturbance
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posted 14 June 2021 19:48      Profile for Disturbance   Email Disturbance   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks Gunner. Thats how I thought it was setup just wanted to make sure. I am still fuzzy on the role of the warrant officers though. At that level is it still Os plan -> srNCOs implement. So would it be the CWO telling the Majors what to do after the LCols develop the plan?

And the movie is goin to be dope. Even gettin make ****ft squibs and ****. Its just to bad that the one friend in the army who would be a great consultant and lead role (ME!) has to go on course the same time they are filming.


Posts: 40 | From: Vancouver, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Bloggins
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posted 15 June 2021 09:01      Profile for Bloggins   Email Bloggins   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I don't think I can add much to Gunner's post, but if you're still confused about who gives orders to who, then here's some more detail. First: any officer theoretically outranks any NCM. Which is to say that on paper the greenest 2lt outranks the most senior CWO. In reality this is a polite fiction, and the senior NCMs often do a very good job of providing a lot of the actual leadership without ever making it obvious. But it does mean that a CSM would not in the normal course of things give orders to a platoon commander.

On a side note, smart armies tend to train individuals up to the next level of the chain of command. That way they can step up when needed. It's quite routine for a platoon warrant to have to step into the platoon commander's shoes after he becomes a casualty.


Posts: 33 | From: Toronto, ON | Registered: Jan 2001  |  IP: Logged
towhey
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posted 15 June 2021 10:50      Profile for towhey   Author's Homepage   Email towhey   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A few other comments:

Infantry Battalion Deputy Commanding Officer is normally a senior Major.

While Infantry Company Commanders are normally Majors, they are sometimes senior Captains (especially where limits on promotions have reduced the number of available Majors.

Inf. Coy Seconds-in-Command are normally junior Captains.

Inf. Coy Combat Support Platoons (Recce, Anti-Armour, Assault Pioneers, Mortars) are normally commanded by junior Captains/Senior Lieutenants.

Each infantry company normally has a Company Quartermaster Sergeant-Major (CQMS) who maintains the stores and manages the logistics of the company. He is usually a Warrant Officer.

Infantry Platoon Second in Command are usually Warrant Officers, or if they are in short supply, senior Sergeants.

While Infantry section commanders are doctrinally Sergeants, they are very often experienced Master Corporals. During my career, Sgts seemed always to be in short supply.

Section 2IC's are, theoretically MCpls, but often in practice are Corporals or even experienced privates.

Each Infantry Rifle Platoon normally has a Weapons Detachment commanded, normally, by a MCpl

Mech Infantry Companies often have a Transport Sergeant, to manage the vehicle fleet and a Company Surveillance/Weapons Detachment commanded by a Sergeant/MCpl -- this is, essentially a small infantry section that reports directly to the Company Commander.

For Officers in the Canadian Army, Captain is the "working rank" -- meaning you may well find more Captains than all the other officer ranks put together. Promotion to Capt is, in my mind, often the point at which an officer has finished his/her "internship" and is suitable to work just about anywhere, line or staff.

2Lt/Lt or "subaltern" ranks are, again in my metaphor, internship ranks where officers have leadership responsibilities, but are also expected be learning as they go. Rarely are 2Lt/Lt's tasked to do things they are experienced at doing - this is how they gain experience.

As they used to say, if you're a 2Lt/Lt you are expected to make mistakes. If you're still making the same mistakes as a Captain, time to look for a real job!

[ 15 June 2001: Message edited by: towhey ]


Posts: 35 | From: toronto, on, canada | Registered: Jan 2001  |  IP: Logged
towhey
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posted 15 June 2021 10:59      Profile for towhey   Author's Homepage   Email towhey   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
On officer / senior NCO relationships.

All officers are superior in rank to all NCMs. However, in practice, the relationship between an officer and his/her senior NCOs is a special one.

As a new 2Lt/Lt platoon commander, you are expected to learn from your platoon WO/Sgt. The buck still stops with you -- and you are ultimately responsible for making the decisions, but you are well advised to heed the counsel of your NCOs.

Good Senior NCOs understand "the dance" and are brilliant at providing advice in a discrete way to their young officers.

Good Company Sergeants Major play an important role in the development of junior officers. In my case, I was blessed with the counsel of excellent CSMs. These experienced NCOs were wise and knew exactly how to nod during meetings or raise their eyebrows, drop "off hand" comments and observations in just the right place at just the right time to help steer platoon commanders, and company commanders along the right path.

They are invaluable.

Of course, that doesn't mean they are always right. But, you would be foolish to not listen to their advice and be sure you had good reason not to heed it.



Posts: 35 | From: toronto, on, canada | Registered: Jan 2001  |  IP: Logged
Soldier of Fortune
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posted 15 June 2021 15:28      Profile for Soldier of Fortune   Email Soldier of Fortune   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
One situation when someone such as a Sargent out ranks an Officer is while on range. If the Sargent is the RSO then he outranks everyone on the range.


[Canadian] [Bullet] Soldier of Fortune [Bullet] [Canadian]


Posts: 112 | From: Tottenham, Ontario | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged
recceguy
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posted 15 June 2021 15:59      Profile for recceguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Allow me to inject some humour, and not necessarily untrue humour at that:

A man is flying a hot air balloon and realises he's lost. He reduces height and spots a man down below. He lowers the balloon further and shouts, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised my friend I would meet him half an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."

The man below says, "Yes. You are in a hot air balloon, hovering approximately 30 feet above this field. You are between 40 and 42 degrees North latitude, and between 58 and
60 degrees West longitude."

"You must be an NCO," says the man.

"I am," replies the NCO. "How did you know?"

"Well," says the balloonist, "everything you have told me is technically correct, but I have no idea what to make of your information, and the fact is I am still lost."

The man below says, "You must be an officer!" "I am," replies the balloonist, "but how did you know?"

"Well," says the NCO, "you don't know where you are, or where you are going. You have made a promise, which you have no idea how to keep, and you expect me to solve your problem. The fact is you are in the exact same position you were in before we met, but now it is somehow my fault."


Posts: 118 | From: Ontario | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
JRMACDONALD
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posted 16 June 2021 00:48      Profile for JRMACDONALD   Email JRMACDONALD   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Recceguy-
Posts: 142 | From: CALGARY,AB, CANADA | Registered: Aug 2000  |  IP: Logged

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